Memphis Big man Moussa Cisse will go through the NBA Draft process and enter the transfer portal@moussacisse224 pic.twitter.com/bv500DIiBy
— B/R Hoops (@brhoops) April 27, 2021
I am hearing things. Anybody else?
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Moussa Cisse
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Last: 3 yr ago by Dawg44
I am hearing things. Anybody else?
What type of things are you hearing, Teddy?
Likely B.S.
People that you know say he is coming.Monkdawg said:
What type of things are you hearing, Teddy?
Yeah, I have been told it's already done. It just hasn't been announced. Hope it's true.
That would be interesting. No scoring though in the post. Are we out on Tre Mitchell or could we get both? If we got both, Crean may have a legitimate shot to make the tournament.
It would be great to get both, but if Mitchell coming requires Crean to hire his mom's boyfriend, I'm not sure Crean will do it.
anything new in dawg hoop world?
i depend on you guys for news.
i depend on you guys for news.
Welp, not much it seems. Our SEC opponents were announced today; there's something I guess. Here is the breakdown with the opponents current T-Ranking according to Torvik and his analytics.
We always play our three designated rivals twice - Auburn (21), Florida (24) & S. Carolina (134). The rotating two we'll play twice this year are Vandy (89) and A&M (131). That'll give the Dawgs a reasonable chance at another couple of W's. 2-8 or so in these 10 games is my guess.
That leaves single games with the other eight teams -
Bama (12), Tennessee (15), @Kentucky (17), Arkansas (28),
@LSU (41), @M St (64), Ole Ms (71), @Mizzou (150). 1-7 here for a 3-15 season is what'll be expected. We'll certainly play the games and hope for the best but don't fool yourself into believing we upgraded our roster.
UGA is currently #213. Our leading scorers are projected to be Horne 14.3, Oquendo 11.5, JAR 9.8, Ingram 8.6,
Ridgnal 6.7, Cook 6.0, Baumann 5.2. Horne and Cook may combine to average 20 but I believe it'll be closer to 10 each. Other #'s look about right.
On paper it's a terribly weak group of talent for an SEC Team, but then we do have Tom Crean as HC
We always play our three designated rivals twice - Auburn (21), Florida (24) & S. Carolina (134). The rotating two we'll play twice this year are Vandy (89) and A&M (131). That'll give the Dawgs a reasonable chance at another couple of W's. 2-8 or so in these 10 games is my guess.
That leaves single games with the other eight teams -
Bama (12), Tennessee (15), @Kentucky (17), Arkansas (28),
@LSU (41), @M St (64), Ole Ms (71), @Mizzou (150). 1-7 here for a 3-15 season is what'll be expected. We'll certainly play the games and hope for the best but don't fool yourself into believing we upgraded our roster.
UGA is currently #213. Our leading scorers are projected to be Horne 14.3, Oquendo 11.5, JAR 9.8, Ingram 8.6,
Ridgnal 6.7, Cook 6.0, Baumann 5.2. Horne and Cook may combine to average 20 but I believe it'll be closer to 10 each. Other #'s look about right.
On paper it's a terribly weak group of talent for an SEC Team, but then we do have Tom Crean as HC
Just as we have no clue how this team will mesh and perform, neither do the prognosticators. I heard a report that the team in summer workouts is shooting lights out. We shall see....
Monkdawg said:
Just as we have no clue how this team will mesh and perform, neither do the prognosticators. I heard a report that the team in summer workouts is shooting lights out. We shall see....
I'm not gonna take the time and list all the "clues" that we and the pronosticators have to base our predictions, but there are more than plenty. In a nutshell - better players out and lesser players in.
Crean's teams have been #197, #247 and #226 in defensive efficiency. That may have something to do with the "shooting lights out" report from summer workouts.
Our defense has been terrible with all those "better talents". How do you know the new guys can't defend? You don't. And I just don't agree that the new guys are "lesser players." Yes, they were not as highly ranked as the some of the players we lost, but once a kid is in school rankings mean nothing. Walton and Brown were higher ranked than Wheeler or Camara; were they better players? The kids who left all had weaknesses and issues. How about we see what we've got with the new guys before we start slamming them?
Monkdawg said:
Our defense has been terrible with all those "better talents". How do you know the new guys can't defend? You don't. And I just don't agree that the new guys are "lesser players." Yes, they were not as highly ranked as the some of the players we lost, but once a kid is in school rankings mean nothing. Walton and Brown were higher ranked than Wheeler or Camara; were they better players? The kids who left all had weaknesses and issues. How about we see what we've got with the new guys before we start slamming them?
The defense (lack of) is 100% a Tom Crean problem. We went from #61 to #197 TC's first year and even worse in years 2 & 3. Wheeler, Camara, Walton, Brown and Johnson were all highly rated 4 Star players. Cook, Ingram, Oquendo, Ridgnal, Baumann and Bridges were all 0 Star (non rated) to 3 Star players. On paper the analytics clearly point towards us being by far the worst team in the conference this year.
Where's the bar for retaining Crean? Is it improvement (8-10), non-losing (9-9) or is it Tourney? Anybody wanna go on record and state they believe any of those happen? Long, long odds.
i stated earlier if horne is our leading scorer we have huge problems.
he cant create his own shots and he is neither big or athletic.
how does that translate into 14 ppg?
where do you find those projections?
my projection remains if horne is leading scorer we will easily be worst team in sec
he cant create his own shots and he is neither big or athletic.
how does that translate into 14 ppg?
where do you find those projections?
my projection remains if horne is leading scorer we will easily be worst team in sec
fladawg59 said:
i stated earlier if horne is our leading scorer we have huge problems.
he cant create his own shots and he is neither big or athletic.
how does that translate into 14 ppg?
where do you find those projections?
my projection remains if horne is leading scorer we will easily be worst team in sec
barttorvik.com is the go to site for predictive analytics. Analytics aren't perfectly predictive of course but they're much more dependable than someone hearing that we're shooting it well in our summer workouts.
#12 UA, #15 UT, #17 UK, #20 AU, #24UF, #28 Ark, #41 LSU
are predicted as our top seven along with #63 MSt, #72 Ole Ms, #89 Vandy - giving the SEC 10 in the Top 100. I'd watch for Miss St to be a tourney team with their talent back plus talent in. S Carolina, A&M and Mizzou look pretty bad and then there is Tom Crean.
thanks.
interesting site.
they like horne better than i do.
i am optimistic about cook. they aren't
interesting site.
they like horne better than i do.
i am optimistic about cook. they aren't
Torvik is apparently an attorney in Minnesota who likes to play with statistics. There's "lies, damn lies and statistics" according to Mark Twain. Again, neither you, nor I, not Bart Torvik has seen this group of players that make up the UGA roster play a single minute. He may be right; he may be wrong. Statistics are wrong all the time. It will all play out in a few months.
It's hard to catch Cowley College, Florida SWCC, UIC, or FAU on television. USC (Baumann) & UVA (JAR) got airtime but those two didn't get off the bench much if at all. So yeah, nobody's seen these guys play. Analytics have changed a bit since the days of Mark Twain. This is more of a "Moneyball" era and some of you are the grumpy old men sitting around the table with Brad Pitt's and Jonah Hill's characters arguing.
Whether they got airtime or not, no one has seen them play together in Crean's system. "Moneyball" is only applicable when there are meaningful stats upon which to base a judgment. We don't have any here. This team may wet the bed - or it might be better than we think. Nobody knows.
Maybe these stats will be meaningful.
We know Crean's teams have been terrible defensively ranking #197, #247 & #226 in Defensive Efficiency. Offensive Efficiency isn't much better ranking #242, #118 & #163. No surprise, these kind of stats have resulted in Crean's 14-40 record at a school with one losing record of 7-11 in the six seasons before his arrival.
If Tom Crean has a system; losing 4* players and replacing them with 0* to 3* players is not going to help him win games.
We know Crean's teams have been terrible defensively ranking #197, #247 & #226 in Defensive Efficiency. Offensive Efficiency isn't much better ranking #242, #118 & #163. No surprise, these kind of stats have resulted in Crean's 14-40 record at a school with one losing record of 7-11 in the six seasons before his arrival.
If Tom Crean has a system; losing 4* players and replacing them with 0* to 3* players is not going to help him win games.
great discussion points on both sides.
this will make the upcoming season even more interesting to watch unfold.
it could be a surprise or an epic fail.
coach's job at stake.
interestingly barttovik has wheeler coming off the bench at kentucky.
this will make the upcoming season even more interesting to watch unfold.
it could be a surprise or an epic fail.
coach's job at stake.
interestingly barttovik has wheeler coming off the bench at kentucky.
I've said it before - star ratings mean nothing once you are in school. Do you really think Brown and Walton played like 4 star players? Of course not. Star ratings just give fans something to talk about during recruiting. David Pollack was a 3 star, but he sure didn't play like a 3 star. We really should put aside this argument that we lost 5 4 star recruits. Star ratings are meaningless once they start playing.
Yes, we have been baaad defensively. And we couldn't shoot offensively. Crean's offense could get an open shot, but the coaches can't make the shot. Crean will never be seen as a defensive coach. We have to improve in that aspect of the game. But, nobody was going to win with Crean's first team. There were some poor players on that team. Crean's 2nd team got a little better but was terribly young. Crean's 3rd team was a little better but struggled to make shots, rebound and defend in the paint, as well as with turnovers. If his 4th team is to be better, we have to improve in a number of facets of the game. Whether the team can do so, time will tell....
Yes, we have been baaad defensively. And we couldn't shoot offensively. Crean's offense could get an open shot, but the coaches can't make the shot. Crean will never be seen as a defensive coach. We have to improve in that aspect of the game. But, nobody was going to win with Crean's first team. There were some poor players on that team. Crean's 2nd team got a little better but was terribly young. Crean's 3rd team was a little better but struggled to make shots, rebound and defend in the paint, as well as with turnovers. If his 4th team is to be better, we have to improve in a number of facets of the game. Whether the team can do so, time will tell....
That team you say nobody could win with had Nicholas Claxton, Rayshaun Hammonds and Derek Ogbeide across the front line - we haven't seen 6th man from UIC Braelyn Bridges play in person but that 2018-19 squad would be a heavy favorite over Crean's 2021-22 team. It's Crean's fourth year and our talent level has never been less.
You talking about the team that went 11-21 (2-16, 13th in SEC)?
Claxton turned into a fine player, as Crean let him play when Fox would not; I love Ogbeide's rebounding and tenacity, but he wasn't much of an offensive player; Hammond's was great against bad teams and disappeared against any team with a heartbeat. I'll never forget Hammond's play in the Georgia State game. He simply rolled over. He certainly did not play like a high 4 star player night in and night out. And let's not leave out Wilridge, Ngumeze, Toppin, Mike Edwards and Connor O'Neill. Of those, Wilridge played a lot; Ngumeze was nuts; Toppin was a distraction; Edwards looked like Tarzan and played like Jane; and, O'Neill was a walk-on.
However, IMHO, college basketball is primarily a guard's game. The guards on that team were simply not competitive with other SEC backcourts. If you can't get the ball up the court, consistently make open outside shots and get the team into its offense or you can't defend other guards off the dribble, you will likely get beat - and we did get beaten, quite often. I notice you didn't say much about the guards on that team. Turtle, Crump, Harris, Hightower, Harrison, Fagan, Sargiunas.... All the high-rated guards were seriously over-rated. Of that bunch, I wouldn't want to go to war with any except maybe Fagan, who was only a freshman at the time. Turtle was not a good ballhandler or shooter; Crump was a one-trick pony whose trick most often failed; Harris probably had the most potential but spent more time injured or ineligible than he did on the floor. Hightower was no leader, and we know what happened with him; Harrison was a walk-on for a reason, but had to play a lot of minutes that season; and, Sargiunas, a late pick-up, just couldn't play at our level. The backcourt was a disaster. I don't blame that on Crean because they were who he was left with by Fox.
The next year we were entirely too young, and our record showed it. Last year, with all the COVID distractions, the team was pulled in too many directions; too many players had their own agendas, and the team suffered for it, though there was some improvement over the previous seasons. I'm getting really tired of reiterating this stuff. Crean will either succeed or he won't, most likely this season. We will see, but none of us knows, and it is counter-productive to expect the worst....
However, IMHO, college basketball is primarily a guard's game. The guards on that team were simply not competitive with other SEC backcourts. If you can't get the ball up the court, consistently make open outside shots and get the team into its offense or you can't defend other guards off the dribble, you will likely get beat - and we did get beaten, quite often. I notice you didn't say much about the guards on that team. Turtle, Crump, Harris, Hightower, Harrison, Fagan, Sargiunas.... All the high-rated guards were seriously over-rated. Of that bunch, I wouldn't want to go to war with any except maybe Fagan, who was only a freshman at the time. Turtle was not a good ballhandler or shooter; Crump was a one-trick pony whose trick most often failed; Harris probably had the most potential but spent more time injured or ineligible than he did on the floor. Hightower was no leader, and we know what happened with him; Harrison was a walk-on for a reason, but had to play a lot of minutes that season; and, Sargiunas, a late pick-up, just couldn't play at our level. The backcourt was a disaster. I don't blame that on Crean because they were who he was left with by Fox.
The next year we were entirely too young, and our record showed it. Last year, with all the COVID distractions, the team was pulled in too many directions; too many players had their own agendas, and the team suffered for it, though there was some improvement over the previous seasons. I'm getting really tired of reiterating this stuff. Crean will either succeed or he won't, most likely this season. We will see, but none of us knows, and it is counter-productive to expect the worst....
dawglegright said:
You talking about the team that went 11-21 (2-16, 13th in SEC)?
Yep, few other than Tom Crean could go 2-16 with the talent
on that squad. When one makes a coaching change, after the first losing record (7-11) in six years, the hope/expectation was we would be better. I certainly didn't see 2-16 coming that season and none of you did either. Go back 17 or 18 pages on here and take a look at folks predictions for that season. I was fairly optimistic predicting 9-9 and thought we'd be bubbling for a bid. That's was before the slow realization that Tom Crean is a joke of a coach.
I agree, let's fire him now.
Agree, and tell the next coach he will be fired after the first loss. We will never have a great/undefeated season unless we demand it. There is no excuse for losing.